Wall mount, and Motion Sensor for studio speakers

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by kmetal, Jun 9, 2018.

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  1. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    hey all. I have a couple alesis 5” driver monitors and was wondering if anyone has had any good luck with a wall mount, either bought or built, for a smallish studio monitor like those (12”h x 10”d x 10” w) roughly.

    Also, I wanted to hook the electrical outlets they plug into into a typical household motion sensor, so when I walk in the room, they turn on and start playing the steady stream I’m feeding them from my home server.

    My goal is to have a centralized server/computer/rack closet or room, and just run the audio and data cables from there to the rest of the rooms in the house, with appropriate signal boosters, ect.


    Thanks!

    I’ll tag @Davedog @dvdhawk since they have a high level of expertise especially in that area as well as others. I’m glad to hear from anyone willing to respond.

    I’m more concerned with starting a fire or breaking building codes or standard practices, as opposed to damaging the speakers. They’re purpose is just for prototyping my system design and configuration.

    Cheers!
     
  2. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk Well-Known Member

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    Do the wallmounts need to be articulated in any direction(s)?

    Occupancy sensors can be wired to receptacles for your magic speakers. Some are motion only, some incorporate infrared. The ones with both are less likely to timeout if you're sitting still in the room. (if you ever sit still)
     
  3. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    Awesome. Thanks for your reply. Lol I rarely sit still these days, but I’ll get one with both types of sensor, so I can use the same model through the entire house. Ahhh uniformity.

    For this particular room, the speaker mounts don’t need to be “articulate-able”. I’m trying this first in the bathroom, so I can re-amp stuff for ambiance, and not have interruptions in my audio. I figured since I’m remodeling half the house, it’s a decent time to run cat5, a/v, usb, to each room as part of the re-model.

    I’m interested in both fixed and articulated mounts, since I’m planning Atmos in my “studio room” and surround in my bedroom.

    Mucho Gracious.
     
  4. cyrano

    cyrano Active Member

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    Your biggest problem will be to have the speakers reconnect to the streaming server automatically on power-up.

    You're not pushing the stream to the speakers, but the speakers are pulling the stream from the server, I imagine.

    What kind of device will be between speakers and network? If it's something like a mini PC, or a Raspberry PI, it's easily scriptable. If not, it might prove difficult.
     
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  5. Boswell

    Boswell Moderator Distinguished Member

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    I feel a bit odd replying to this thread, as the tracking speaker concept is something I would actively avoid being in the presence of. Nevertheless, treating it as a design problem, this is what I would do:

    I would use powered monitors (loudspeakers containing their own mains powered amps). These need only be relatively low power, but should have auto shut-off, i.e. power down after a fixed time with no input. If you were in the UK, you would not be allowed to have a mains outlet socket inside the bathroom, so you would need to run the speakers' mains cables through the wall to a position outside the bathroom door, and plug into a mains outlet there.

    For the signal, I would use a remote switch such as the RDL ST-RX2. The device can be used for balanced (+4dBu) or unbalanced signals, and routes an audio input to one of two selected outputs based on a low d.c. current (0.5mA) selector signal that your proximity detector could provide. Connect your music feed to the input and the speaker(s) to whichever output is selected when the selector current signal is active. The ST-RX2 needs 24V at 40mA d.c. power from something like a wall wart supply, again positioned outside the bathroom.

    Let us know how you get on!
     
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  6. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk Well-Known Member

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    Hey Kyle, help me understand something. Part of this is for re-amping purposes? So you're lugging in an amplifier, mic(s), cable(s), stand(s) and you can't be bothered to flip a switch to turn something on? Wanting music to follow you around the house is one thing. I'm scratching my head about integrating all of this.

    I'm not dumping on the idea, I just feel like I must be missing something that justifies the expense and effort.

    AC receptacles are very common in US bathrooms, but any construction/wiring of the modern era would require GFCI outlets for any "wet location" (bathroom, kitchen, bar, laundry/utility room, garage, outdoor - to name a few ).
     
  7. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    My initial thinking, since I’m (unfortunately) not experienced with raspberry PI yet, was to have a simple $8 BT transmitter (from Wally World) plugged into another, not switched outlet, near the entry door of the bathroom. I would then run the LV audio cable to the speakers, and eventually have wall mounted jacks if the concept works.

    I would feed the BT transmitter (or is it technically a receiver?) from an old tablet, one of my NAS drives, ect. I have a tiny portable am/fm radio i could use too.

    The concept being that a dedicated audio signal is always feeding into the bathroom, and the speakers turn on and off automatically, upon entry and vacancy.

    With BT I could stream from various devices.

    For instance- I’m listening to a sports broadcast, or I’m working on a mix, and need to hop in the shower, and don’t want to miss anything. The idea being I don’t have to touch anything to hear my media. (OCD) as it may be described I have a fair amount of fairly dirty/shitty jobs to do on this remodel, and in general, and I like to listen to music. This way I don’t have to press buttons on anything after cleaning rat droppings, for example, on my way into the shower, then press the same buttons on my way out when I’m ‘clean’.

    Mental hang ups aside, I’m interested in remote recording anyway, and I have a limited electronics knowledge that I seek to expand as far as my ideas need it to.

    I appreciate the reply, does this seem to make sense technically?

    Good call on the Radial box, I’m gonna look into it after the ‘proof of concept phase’.

    May I ask why you would avoid the ‘tracking speaker concept’. Do you mean re-amping or the motion sensitivity? Just curious. Thanks.

    I have a pair of Active Alesis Monitor One Mk3’s, and a pair of Passive Bose ‘All weather’ water resistant speakers, w/ a Denon multi-channel receiver in an adjacent room, from which i could run a couple speaker wires to, of the motion sensor doesn’t make sense.

    Yes the other half, besides entertainment (I’m moving away from pure audio engineering- ie years of my life recording ‘Johnny and The Sore Throats’, into the entertainment tech, custom electronics, and remote recording/mixing realms. I feel the market is broader, and gives me a chance to be on the curve, rather than behind it as I always have been)

    I initially am thinking active speakers. No lugging (plethora of documented back problems). I’d mount a hardwired mic permanently, or use a wireless one (more for testing than utmost fidelity), and have a dedicated channel on my interface/daw.

    So it’s both a Star Trek audio listening experience (motion sensor) and a re-amping tool. Having barely used algorithmic reverb since I started at the the commercial studios around ‘09, I am searching for ways to get that effect, now that I am working out of this new rental home more often than not. I do have about 6 new reverb plugs in my software set as well.

    Due to my imagination, mental/physical crap, and bordem, my feeling is that my entire system should be acessable, from anywhere, needing nothing more than a phone/tablet or laptop.

    Installed a motion/occupancy sensor in the bathroom a while back for the lights and I am satisfied with it, as well as hard wired led night lights around the house, which turn on when the sun goes down.

    I planned on GFCI outlets for code reasons, and in general for this type of thing because of the breaker in it.

    Not sure if this leaves you scratching your head even more Dave, lol, you wouldn’t be alone in that reguard.

    My end goal is a fully automated household and audio system. Lights, doors, thermostats, as well as a ‘self cleaning’ home with robot vac, and a sprinkler system (where applicable) to spray sanitizer ect.

    Obviously this is a bit over the top by today’s standards, but I don’t think unrealistic for the future of zero energy loss, smart homes.

    As far as the $$ goes. I’m using all basic level stuff, as a proof of concept. Should it actually work, or be useful, i can upgrade the pieces.

    I dunno I guess I could just build a mic or a pre amp kit, but it seems a little pedestrian to me at this point, and I don’t have the studio room set up anyway so it wouldn’t be useful right now.

    I always hated having to leave the sweet spot to adjust an eq or pre level, and I hated running 40ft thru several doors, to move the mic a centimeter, again and again. They already have motorized mic stands and the app for the phone, i just can’t justify the expense for this Mad Science project.

    My favorite part of audio engineering is listening and manipulating the controls, aside from being present when a good band is tracking live.

    Not sure if this clears things up or causes more face palms and eye rolls, lol. Thanks reguardless.
     
  8. Boswell

    Boswell Moderator Distinguished Member

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    Take care - it's not Radial, it's RDL, a different company.
    Just a personal thing, and nothing to do with re-amping. I like to be able to walk away from continuously playing reproduced sounds.
    The "All weather" speakers might be ideal for use in the shower. If their response goes high enough you could go in for some ultrasonic cleaning, especially of those difficult-to-reach places.
     
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  9. cyrano

    cyrano Active Member

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    I'm afraid BlueTooth is a bit of a mess when it comes to audio. It's very much a one-to-one connection. Meaning, you have to pair these things and you can't pair most BT solutions for audio to more than one device.

    Also, older BT devices need heavy compression to send audio and the range will be fairly limited.

    What could be a solution is Apple's AirPlay (over Wifi). There's software to use AirPlay from a Windows device as "sender" and a Raspberry as receiver (with the open source ShairPlay). Have a look here about the differences between BT and Airplay:

    http://www.audiogurus.com/learn/speakers/bluetooth-vs-airplay/446

    It's not as cheap as BT, but will offer the range I think you need and the multi receiver capability. And there are a lot of options for "receivers" besides Apple's own venerable Airport Express or Apple TV.

    Other than Airplay, I can only imagine FM. But it probably isn't legal to operate an FM transmitter over a few milliwatts.

    I have four old Airport Express routers for audio in different rooms and one old Apple TV, used for audio only, on their own wifi network, as they don't support WPA2 encryption. That works very well, it even syncs audio to multiple speaker pairs at once. Speakers are powered and switch on when receiving audio. No sensor needed.

    I've bought these routers for 10 to 50 € each, second hand, as they no longer are secure. Audio quality is 16 bit, 48 kHz and they have Toslink optical audio out besides analog, if needed.

    They also have excellent power management and only consume about 1.5 W when idling.

    Other Airplay receivers:
    https://www.makeuseof.com/tag/4-airplay-receivers-that-are-cheaper-than-apple-tv/

    There used to be Airplay receivers from Denon and TEAC too. But these seem to have been dropped from the product list. These days, most Airplay enabled devices are simple mono speakers. Some are very good, like the B&W Zeppelin.

    The major disadvantage is a 2 second latency.

    Airplay 2 is out. But don't worry, it doesn't offer much new and the old Airplay will still work for your application. Info about Airplay 2:

    https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2018/5/29/17406748/sonos-one-airplay-2-speaker
     
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  10. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    There’s a saying, if there’s no highs, and no lows, it must be Bose. Lmafo about the ultrasonic cleaning. Good one.!


    Thanks for so such a detailed response, I’m gonna read up those links. I had an Apple TV at one point and was satisfied with the quality, seems like a more reliable path to trot.
     
  11. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    I’m glad some of the other concerns seem to have good solutions!

    Any recommendations on mounts? I have some mono price mounts for the bose speakers (just basic surround sound type), my concern was the Alesis’s 12lbs weight. The only advantage I could see to the Alesis is they are full range.
     
  12. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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  13. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk Well-Known Member

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    I like the idea of it offering support from the bottom, since the Alesis speakers don't have any mounting structure built into them that I know of. The clamp feature is nice I suppose. But I'm sure you realize you're almost certainly going to need to run screws into the bottom and/or side of the speaker. I assume they're made of MDF which would give you one good chance to sink a set of screws.

    My 2 cents anyway.
     
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  14. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    I didn’t realize this, i wrongly thought the side clamps were like a vice. No big deal if I have to put a couple holes thru the MDF. The home store has industrial Velcro rated at 15lbs, so I’m wondering if that would be enough in combination with the side clamps. The only other thing I can think of would be some steel strapping or cable to wrap around the speakers and mounts, or as a leash, attached to the wall.

    I’m gonna dig some more to see if I can find something adequate that requires no modification.

    I may bypass the wireless and just use and otherwise worthlessly slow tablet to connect to the speakers via a cable.

    Thanks
     
  15. dvdhawk

    dvdhawk Well-Known Member

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    I'm guessing they're a spring-loaded affair at best, but you might be right. In any case, now that I'm looking closely at the pictures they've run screws through the vertical part of the side clamp into the lower side.
     
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  16. kmetal

    kmetal Kyle P. Gushue Well-Known Member

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    I think I’ll email Or call Alesis this week. They are based out of Rhode Island, which is 30min south of me. They might be able to recommend something. This is why I’m starting with relatively low priced speakers, as the thought of drilling into a premium nearfield hurts.

    Worse comes to worse I’ll use a couple of those L brackets used for shelves, but I kinda liked the purpose built look of ‘real’ mounts.
     

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