Loud headphones

Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2009 6:25 pm

First off I would like to say that this is a rocking fourm, lots of great info and this is my first post.

I need some advice. I just started tracking an extremely heavy metal band, they are very talented but we are having a hard time getting a good preformance out of the lead singer. I have heard him live and he is very impressive but is lacking in the studio.

He is complaining I cannot get the levels in the headphones loud enough for him. I have the syestem output gain all the way up, the headphone out gain all the way up, and the headphone amp channel gain maxed. I checked the level myself and to me it is blistering loud, and not to mention how terrible it sounds. I think he is looking for near concert sound level. Anyone know about some headphones that can get a serious output and not have to gain the singnal till its mud?

I have done some google serches on headphones but i have not had any luck. Thanks guy!

Wane Tango
www.fatrockinc.com
wanetango@fatrockinc.com

Posted: Sat Oct 03, 2009 7:54 pm

Welcome to RO Wane,

What kind of headphones are you using? With what kind of headphone amp?

Impedance of the headphones can make all the difference in the world.

Posted: Sun Oct 04, 2009 9:48 am

WaneTango wrote:

He is complaining I cannot get the levels in the headphones loud enough for him.

Which levels? Does he want his vocals more prominent, or does he just want the whole shebang loud enough to cause permanent hearing loss so he can live the dream of a deaf rock star?

If he's complaining that he can't hear his vocals monitored against the roar, then that's a monitor mix problem, and can be fixed by simply turning him up against the mix. If the mix is OK, and he just thinks he needs it louder...and it's "blistering" to you, then he's either half deaf already, or just plain crazy.

If it's the latter, a real professional wouldn't want to damage their most valuable instrument. You should mention that to him.

Kapt.Krunch

Posted: Thu Oct 29, 2009 10:37 pm

I agree dvdhawk, ohms are significant here, akg's can sound quiet as they have a higher impeadence vs similar costing AT's, what is the budget also?

Posted: Thu Oct 29, 2009 11:23 pm

AEX-Labs wrote:

I agree dvdhawk, ohms are significant here, akg's can sound quiet as they have a higher impeadence vs similar costing AT's, what is the budget also?

That's not entirely true.
The K240Ms have a rather high impedance. However, the K240S and many of the other K2xx line have a 60 ohm impedance. I've got about a half a dozen pair of both the M and the S and the lower impedance one wins out for most things, but ultimately, the higher impedance one seems to be more accurate.

I would also urge, as already stated, to try raising only the vocal and perhaps putting a reverb (short) on it as well. If all the levels are maxed, regardless of impedance, your singer will be deaf in short order. Sometimes this can be a blessing - your call.

Posted: Thu Oct 29, 2009 11:47 pm

Cucco wrote:

,,, the K240S and many of the other K2xx line have a 60 ohm impedance,,,

oops, forgot they made those 60ohm'ers, just so used to the m's, thanks Cucco

Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2009 12:19 am

this reminds me of when i was in a metal band in high school. our singer (screamer) always wanted more level, and never wanted himself in the monitors. when he could hear himself his confidence went down and so did his ability to scream well. he thrived off the live performance, and with screaming its more in how it feels than sounds. at least in my experience.
you might want to try putting him in a room with a PA blaring at him instead of a headphone mix. its easier to jam when you feel the mix. Ask him if that is the case, and maybe try taking him out all together of the mix. more comfortable singer = better performance = better recording.

Cons - bleed from speakers, and if he goes off key, you have to smack him yourself cause he doesn't know.

also remember with metal, a little "live" sound isnt terrible.

maybe im totally off, but its worth a shot.

Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2009 1:32 am

I would check out the extreme isolation headphones. They will shut out the external sounds and you won't need to turn it up as much.

Posted: Sat Oct 31, 2009 5:12 pm

"Cons - bleed from speakers, and if he goes off key, you have to smack him yourself cause he doesn't know."

RemyRAD, I think it was, described a technique she had used once in this situation... for a full ensemble of something. More than there were pairs of headphones.

After the take, you ensure that the mics don't move, not even one quarter of an inch!
Clear the musicians out of the room (not the instruments).
Then record another track, with the monitor mix playing.
You can then mix that in (with inverted phase) at the right volume to cancel out the bleed.

^^ not my idea, of course.

Posted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 12:06 pm

Codemonkey wrote:

"
You can then mix that in (with inverted phase) at the right volume to cancel out the bleed.

genius

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