Mic closet recommendations

Posted: Thu Nov 25, 2004 3:51 pm

Here's a list that I decided to compile that may help those of you who are asking what are the "studio standards" when it comes to mics. These are the ones I think are a a bare minimum requirement, the "must have" to run a respectable project or professional studio. The up side is this is a complete "wish list" which should serve almost any pop production house. I am guessing as to the cost of this list but I am reasonably sure I am in the ballpark ... perhaps Littledog can give us a package price on this "KF's Studio Pac" ???

Neumann
U87ai w/shock mount & box (one)
$2500

Shure
SM57 (four) drums, guitars, vocals etc.
$ 360
SM7b ( one) bass amps, kick, vocals.
$ 300

ElectroVoice
RE20 (at least one) bass amps, kick, vocals,
$ 300

Senheisser
421 (four),drums, guitars, vocals etc.
$1200
441 (one) vocals, horns, woodwinds, snare, kick.
$ 400
409/609 (four) toms, snare, guitars, vocals etc.
$ 400

Beyer
201 (two) snare, guitar amps, vocals etc.
$ 400

AKG
451 or 460 / 480 (at least three) acoustic instruments, drum overheads, hi hat.
$1000
D112 (at least two) kick, floor toms, bass amps, guitar amps, vocals.
$ 400

AUDIX
D6 (at least one) kick, floor toms.
$ 200

Audio Technica
4033 (at least two) toms, drum oh's, guitars, horns, woodwinds, vocals etc.
$ 800

Total package: = $8260

Posted: Mon Nov 29, 2004 10:20 pm

Nice list, thanks Kurt. Many of us with personal studios can benefit from it as well (although in my case not the whole list). Laughing

One curious ommision was the AKG 414. Is this no longer considered a studio standard or is it's ground covered by the others enough that it's not necessary? Thanks again!

Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 1:19 am

You're right ... the omission of the 414 was an oversight ... altough in the context of "the list", 414's may be redundant ... perhaps a substitution of the AKG "pencils" or perhaps the ATM 4033's for the 414 would be an option ... I'm trying to hold down the costs.

Once again, these are my choices ... opinions and milage may vary ...

Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 5:43 pm

Quote:

Once again, these are my choices ... opinions and milage may vary ...

And some great choices they are!

Thanks again for the explanation and list.

Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 5:49 pm

kurt how about a mic pre list?
for different uses would be great too...
drums, bass, guitars, vocals, keys

Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:27 pm

Mic pres are a different thing ... so much is subjective and depends on the level of the studio, if their interfaces have pres, if they have a console or not and many other things ... (too much to list) ...

Rather than a list of specific pres, it would be better to look at the criteria of what makes a good mic pre.. I posted a list like this, of what I thought makes a good pre, just a little while ago ... I'll look around to see if I can find it.

Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:39 pm

thks kurt...

since we're on the subject what do you think are tube mic pres limitations? you think they don't fit well with some instruments or vocals or whatever? or are they always good?

Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 7:08 pm

OK I found the post ....

"I will usually go for Class A, transformer balanced, all discreet, point to point wired, mic pres and compressors. With the exception of a few, the devices that use LSI chips, op amps and surface mounted components are not desirable to me. There are a few exceptions like the Focusrite Red range, API's, Neve Amek 9098 series and the JLM TMP8, all which use chips or op amps ... The 9098 does not have transformers either and relies heavily on chip technology as well but the EQ in it so good I overlook that. ."

Quote:

"what do you think are tube mic pres limitations? you think they don't fit well with some instruments or vocals or whatever? or are they always good?"

I don't think there are any real limitations to tube pres to speak of .. perceived as an issue is they tend to have a higher noise floor but if you know how to record correctly, it's not so much an issue ... (hint: signal masks noise) ..

I have mentioned before ... many of the recordings I think are the best ever done were recorded using all tube gear .. mic, pres, comps recorders ... I would be able to do good work with only tube pres ... as well as with only solid state ones .. I do believe that what you record, is much more critical than what you record it with .

Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 7:14 pm

so what's your favourite combination for vocals?
mic, pre, compressor and or anything more?

Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 8:05 pm

It's impossible to make a blanket statement like that ... too many variables. Things like voice, song, genre', which mic is best suited will also dictate certain pres be used ...

One combo for my voice I have found to be very nice is the Sebatron VMP with a Neumann U87ai ... I also really like the Great River MP2NV on just about everything I have tried it on ... this IMO may be one of the most versatile pres I have come across to date ... I can't think of a single instance where I have put the MP2NV up and then said, "ohhh, let's try something else".

Mics I tend to prefer on vocals..
U87, ATM 4033's, AKG 414 or C12 ... the C12a is nice as well but can be a bit noisy on quiet sources.. I like the RE20 and the Shure SM7a in the dynamics department but for a soft, quiet female vocals sometimes a 421 works well ... a real surprise for me was the AKG D112 on male vocals ... very nice sometimes. This is why it's nice to have a mic locker that offers choices. It all depends on the before stated criteria,

As to comps I lean towards classic or classically inspired pieces like the URIE line ... LA2a, LA3, LA4's ... 1176 / 1178 ... a little known but nice comp is the UREI LA22 ... of course the DBX 160 ... I have a Manley EL OP that I really like ..

The thing I like about the opto types is they are simple to use and unless you try to pull out like 15 dB with them, they are relatively unobtrusive, not adding a lot of artifacts.

Posted: Tue Nov 30, 2004 8:20 pm

i just bought a c414 tlII for vocals and guitars... (i'll try it on hi-hat too till i get a c451b)
the d112 i want to try on male background vocals! i think it can be interesting or maybe on some vocals with that old radio feel (it can balance that eq highs... i think...)
as for the Sebatron is on my whish list as it is the maybe the tmp8
have to see budgets (wanted to try focusrite octopre, m-audio octane, rme octamic) the tmp8 i know i can't try but i can see the results from this ones with your review kurt...
the thing that it's getting me really mad is acoustic treatment! here in europe auralex and other companies have their prices at least 2x more than there...

do you tend to use the compresser always on the recording stage?

Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2004 12:34 pm

Kurt, many thanks for this thread and the excellent recommendations....

Could you say what constitutes a set of 'minimalist' mics - ie for doing rock / pop / jazz & vocals but capping at say six or eight mics?

In other words, find $Cheap replacement for 421s and alternative to the U87 pair?

I'm at the stage where I have need for batch of drum mics, the SM57 (3), AKG D-112 and C 418PP clip-on condenser. Also, have a stereo pair of the Rode NT1-A (and another Rode in storage).

Today's recording also finds me doing a lot of acoustic gtr.

Posted: Sat Dec 04, 2004 4:30 pm

michael_midfi wrote:

Could you say what constitutes a Cheap replacement for 421s and alternative to the U87 pair?

The "list" is a bare minimum for what I would consider a respectable studio. The U87ai offers multi pattern operation ... as does the AKG414 ... You can perhaps substitute the 414 for the U87 but the 414 is a more "focused" mic ... it doesn't pick up ambience as well ... I also would recommend the Studio Projects C3 as a replacment for the U87 but again, you are now entering "cheapo land" ..
As a replacment for the 421's, SM 57's are surprisigly good .. you could also try the Sennheiser 609. .

Posted: Mon Dec 06, 2004 6:53 am

Hey Kurt, great list!

I notice that you do not list any ribbon mics. Any comments there? I am considering adding a ribbon to the collection for bit different flavor.

Posted: Mon Dec 06, 2004 7:02 pm

Either the Royer 121 or the AEA 44 / 77's are nice modern ribbons ... The Coles 4033 is a classic design that can be purchased new. All these are good. I wouldn't but a used ribbon mic unless someone like Wes Dooley had checked it out.

I usually shy away from ribbons because they are so expensive, delecate and need to be handled with care ... You can ruin a ribbon mic just carrying it across the room .. Plus I'm the kind of guy that usually winds up boosting a bit in the "air" regions, so what's the sense? ... I usually lean towards condensers.

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