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radiophonic
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Feb 12, 2001
Posts: 50
Location: Dallas, TX
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Posted:
Wed Feb 21, 2001 12:52 pm |
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It seems that everyone here has to deal with this eventually -- what are your tricks to tame small rectangular room problems?<P>I find smatterings of details for room treatments involving Owens Corning 703, but very few details on actual implementations. <P>What are people doing for a low cost solution? Are you hiring consultants to measure your rooms?<P>Say for a standard room size of 12x10 w/ 8ft ceilings, and a materials cost of $500-$1000, what can be done to balance the sound for mixing?<P>Looking forward to the approaches...<P>Graham |
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Tymish
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Feb 13, 2001
Posts: 88
Location: Washington DC
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Posted:
Wed Feb 21, 2001 12:59 pm |
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There are a few books on this subject with plans. One I recommend is "How to Build a Small Budget Recording Studio From Sratch" by F. Alton Everest and Mike Shea from TAB books. I hope it's still in print but there are others. Getting the basic principles of acoustics is most important first. Room modes, reflection, refraction, absorbtion etc. A solution for one room is a disaster in another. |
_________________ Yuri Terleckyj<BR>Broadcast Technician<BR>Recording Engineer<P>POP...POP "Is this thing on?" |
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John Sayers
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Feb 18, 2001
Posts: 46
Location: Byron Bay - Australia
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Posted:
Wed Feb 21, 2001 1:47 pm |
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graham - we are currently treating a small control room for FUNKY in Macedonia. You can check it out at our <BR>Studios Under Construction site<BR> <A HREF="http://www.angelfire.com/al3/studio/index.htm" TARGET=_blank>http://www.angelfire.com/al3/studio/index.htm</A> |
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radiophonic
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Feb 12, 2001
Posts: 50
Location: Dallas, TX
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Posted:
Wed Feb 21, 2001 2:41 pm |
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I do have one of the recent F.A. Everest books - sound studio construction on a budget. The typical setup for the type of room I'm currently in resorted to a recommendation for an RPG solution - which is not something I'd call 'shoestring budget'. I need to finish the book - but I was rather disappointed that it didn't include more in the way of plans for construction and room treatment.<P>I'll do some more reading... anyone else have a good book recommendation (and/or a referral to someone in Dallas?)<P>Thanks,<P>Graham |
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JCG
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Mar 6, 2001
Posts: 15
Location: Ottawa, Canada
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Posted:
Tue Mar 06, 2001 1:13 pm |
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Actually, the "slat" type diffusor that RPG makes is not that difficult to build yourself. Everest's "Master Handbook of Acoustics" (at least the 3rd and 4th editions, don't know about earlier ones) has the math you need (and it ain't that much, QRD diffusors are actually pretty simple). It's also in Everest's contributions to the New Audio Cyclopedia (in a bit more detail, including how to calculate theoretical min and max frequencies). Alternately, AcoustiSoft's ETF measurement software includes designer software for QRD diffusers and Helmholz (sp?) resonators.<P>Hope this helps,<BR> John |
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John Sayers
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Feb 18, 2001
Posts: 46
Location: Byron Bay - Australia
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Posted:
Sat Mar 10, 2001 2:43 pm |
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Here's a link to a helmoltz calculator. It's an Excel file so you must have excel on your puter. <BR> <A HREF="http://www.lis.net.au/~johnsay/Acoustics/Images/Helmholtz.xls" TARGET=_blank>http://www.lis.net.au/~johnsay/Acoustics/Images/Helmholtz.xls</A> |
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Ethan Winer
Respected Past Moderator

Joined: Mar 19, 2001
Posts: 3190
Location: New Milford, CT USA
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Posted:
Mon Mar 19, 2001 8:20 pm |
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Graham,<P>> I find smatterings of details for room treatments involving Owens Corning 703, but very few details on actual implementations.<<P>I suggest you check out my article "Build a Better Bass Trap" from EM. It's on my web site's Articles page:<BR> <A HREF="http://www.ethanwiner.com/articles.html" TARGET=_blank>www.ethanwiner.com/articles.html</A> <P>This article shows how to build real bass traps for not much money. Let me know if you have any questions afterward.<P>--Ethan |
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Rick Powell
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Feb 15, 2001
Posts: 20
Location: Ottawa IL USA
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Posted:
Mon Mar 19, 2001 9:36 pm |
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For Ethan:<P>I have read your article and have it archived. What size trap and plywood "resonator board" thickness would you suggest for a resonant frequency of 49 hz? This is the worst of the frequencies in my rectangular room.<P>Thanks,<P>Rick Powell/Studio71 |
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Ethan Winer
Respected Past Moderator

Joined: Mar 19, 2001
Posts: 3190
Location: New Milford, CT USA
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Posted:
Tue Mar 20, 2001 7:19 am |
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Rick,<P>> What size trap and plywood "resonator board" thickness would you suggest for a resonant frequency of 49 hz?<<P>How have you determined this is the worst frequency? From measurements alone? I'm sure if you build the traps as shown in the plans you'll see a big reduction in standing waves at <I>all</I> the low frequencies.<P>--Ethan |
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Aaron Carey
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Dec 20, 2000
Posts: 214
Location: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
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Posted:
Tue Mar 20, 2001 10:00 am |
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Regarding accoustics, The F. Alton Everest stuff is talked about, and is very good in theory, although many consider Everest to be the "Roger Nichols" of accoustic design. I am notgonna say anything bad, but read into that what you wish.<P>I would very very highly reccomend a book called " Handbook for Sound Engineers the New Audio Cyclopedia"<BR>This book has LOTS of good pages on accoustics, even some by George Augsperger! Not to mention there are pages on everything to do with studios including grounding, op amps, summing, you name it.<P>Also do a search on the internet using keywords " Augsperger, Newell, and Hidley "<BR>Many accoustic areas cannot be " scaled down" but the principles still apply |
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JCG
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Mar 6, 2001
Posts: 15
Location: Ottawa, Canada
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Posted:
Tue Mar 20, 2001 1:49 pm |
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Aaron,<P>I have the current (second) edition of the New Audio Cyclopedia and most of the sections on acoustics were written by... <drum roll please> ... F Alton Everest. I would recommend Philip Newell's books as well (and Jeff Cooper's if you can find it), but no one else (that I've seen) includes the construction detail and background that Everest's books have. As for Everest, I'd recommend The Master Handbook of Acoustics (especially the 4th edition, which came out last Spring) or his stuff in the Cyclopedia over either of the two Everest "Build a Studio..." titles, unless you are (luckily) in a situation very close to the example studios he discusses in those books. I don't think the "Build..." books add much to what you can glean from the Master Handbook or Cyclopedia.<P>My $0.02 (Canadian),<BR> John |
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Rick Powell
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Feb 15, 2001
Posts: 20
Location: Ottawa IL USA
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Posted:
Tue Mar 20, 2001 9:20 pm |
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Ethan,<P>This is a room mode that calculates out to 49 hz (parallel walls at 11'-6"). It is confirmed by a frequency sweep I did in the room, and by the excess energy created in the room by a bass "A" note with a fundamental frequency near 49 hz. But I agree there are many reasons to do a broadband treatment. I recall a note in your article indicating the "low" bass trap was effective around 70 hz; I just want to make sure, if I build it to the specifications in your article, that it is broadband enough to catch the 49 Hz wave. Or if I should use a larger or deeper trap, or go slightly thicker on the resonant plywood.<P>Thanks,<P>Rick Powell/Studio71 |
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Ethan Winer
Respected Past Moderator

Joined: Mar 19, 2001
Posts: 3190
Location: New Milford, CT USA
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Posted:
Wed Mar 21, 2001 7:55 am |
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Rick,<P>> I agree there are many reasons to do a broadband treatment. I recall a note in your article indicating the "low" bass trap was effective around 70 hz; I just want to make sure, if I build it to the specifications in your article, that it is broadband enough to catch the 49 Hz wave. Or if I should use a larger or deeper trap, or go slightly thicker on the resonant plywood.<<P>Good point. I "tested" the traps I built for my studio by playing various sine waves and touching the trap panels. If I felt it vibrating I assumed it was working at those frequencies. I verified the low-bass traps down to 60 Hz. They may work lower than that. But I can't see any reason not to build a few of the low traps five inches deep instead of four if you'd like to ensure they go down a little lower.<P>--Ethan |
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Kris
Recording Org Pro Audio Group

Joined: Feb 13, 2001
Posts: 7
Location: Tallahassee
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Posted:
Thu Mar 22, 2001 11:45 am |
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Can't seem to link to your bass trap article, are you sure that the address is correct? |
_________________ Kris<BR>Log Cabin Studio<BR>Tallahassee, FL<BR>kolp@nu.cs.fsu.edu |
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Ethan Winer
Respected Past Moderator

Joined: Mar 19, 2001
Posts: 3190
Location: New Milford, CT USA
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Posted:
Fri Mar 23, 2001 9:18 am |
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Kris,<P>> Can't seem to link to your bass trap article, are you sure that the address is correct? <<P>Yep. Here it is again:<BR> <A HREF="http://www.ethanwiner.com/articles.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.ethanwiner.com/articles.html</A> <P>Then scroll down a bit to that article.<P>--Ethan |
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